Why is "demand" in scare-quotes? I never said that, and it's a loaded term.
The issue here is suggesting you shouldn't freely criticise flaws in FOSS software. This is harmful, and goes directly to affecting information people have available to them in choosing whether or not to use a piece of software in the first place.
Do you actually know what money/time OP might be spending, losing, or making on Django?
> FOSS gives you freedom to do these things on your own. Money gets you other people doing it for you.
What a cop out. A lack of being paid (money at least) doesn't imply no obligations, nor freedom from criticism.
> Why is "demand" in scare-quotes? I never said that, and it's a loaded term.
Because I was referring to coldtea's demands.
> What a cop out. A lack of being paid (money at least) doesn't imply no obligations, nor freedom from criticism.
Excellent, then you should be fine with me criticizing the attitude that's been displayed here.
> The issue here is suggesting you shouldn't freely criticise flaws in FOSS software. This is harmful, and goes directly to affecting information people have available to them in choosing whether or not to use a piece of software ion the first place.
Why is this the conclusion you draw from my posts? I said it before, the Python 3 transition sucked. It's something we kind of all agree on. There is plenty of criticism to be made.
However, I really want to recontextualize this: Django is an open source project, maintained by a non-profit. Python is an open source project, maintained by a non-profit. The projects in question, with "tens of millions of lines of Python 2 code" (only a tiny amount of which would need to be ported, but I disgress...), are most often for-profit projects. Yeah, it's a bit rich.
This is the same as the IE6 situation: Want support for it? Pay extra for it! You should not expect free support for technology for which the EOL was announced years in advance just because you're using a lot of it. And you will have no issue finding paid support. Heck tell you what, if you do, shoot me an email, I do contract work sometimes.
You know why FOSS is great? It's great because the PSF/DSF do not get to revoke your license to use the software they're no longer supporting. You get to use it forever. This is your freedom and it's a good one. Make use of it!
>> A lack of being paid (money at least) doesn't imply no obligations, nor freedom from criticism.
> Excellent, then you should be fine with me criticizing the attitude that's been displayed here.
Great. Do you actually have a response to this point in context, then?
> This is the same as the IE6 situation: Want support for it? Pay extra for it!
You did not argue this. You said "shit on", which doesn't translate to "demanding support". you are deflecting from the one thing I actually criticised.
Your strawman is "support is being demanded" - this isn't the case. Any further arguments on that topic are just beating the strawman.
Furthermore, oficially changing the direction of Django also may affect contributions, changes to the roadmap or architectural design for example.
You're appropriating criticism that was not directed to you, but to coldtea. Here and elsewhere.
Edit: Yes, appropriating. You're taking criticism I specifically directed at coldtea, applying them to your comments and then complaining it doesn't fit. I am done talking to you.
Edit 2: This was not meant to sound as aggressive as it did, sorry.
You've been breaking HN's civility rule with bits like "I am done talking to you", "Oh my god stop", "bitching on HN", etc. That's not cool, regardless of how wrong other commenters may be. Please take greater care to be respectful in comments here.
FOSS gives you freedom to do these things on your own. Money gets you other people doing it for you.