Hacker Newsnew | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin

Any idea if and how this ruling (if upheld) can be used to refuse phone seizures / password requests by CBP when entering the country? The ruling relies on the 5th amendment so its scope is limited to American citizens I guess. And whatever the rule of law it’s probably not a good idea to piss off a CBP agent... but still, it’d be nice to be able to travel to the US without having to wipe one’s phone and social media accounts.


I highly doubt it, even for American citizens at the border. The "Border search exception" pretty much says that anywhere within 100 miles of a boarder, the fourth amendment doesn't apply[1]. I imagine they would make a similar rule for the fifth amendment.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Border_search_exception


Citizens can’t be denied entry. Worst case if you refuse to turn over your phone password is a short (hours, maybe days) detention, and confiscation of your phone.

Non-citizen admittance is at the discretion of the immigration officer and they can turn you away for just about any reason.

Either way, yes, this ruling wouldn’t change anything there.


they can detain you for a limited amount of time, but they can confiscate your devices for an indefinite period.


Well, you couldn't trust the device after they returned it. So losing it isn't a problem.

The best option is not carrying devices across borders. Have whatever you need online somewhere. Securely encrypted, of course. Buy a device at destination. And discard it before return. That's accepted best practice for security-conscious firms. They'll provide devices and online storage.

If you must carry a device in transit, it ought to be plain-vanilla, with nothing sensitive on it. Again, security-conscious firms supply such devices for staff. And private individuals can just say that they're too concerned about theft to carry their primary devices.


Exactly. If the government takes your phone and gives it back its time to wipe the phone and sell it. Restore a backup on to a new phone.


I'm thinking about a good device strategy. I think I need a disposable smartphone for situations like this. I should not lose any data if I lose the smartphone and nobody should gain any data if he finds/steals/takes it.


A lot of "freedom" fighters suggest this as SOP anyways. You keep all of your needed data in the cloud, and download on the other side of whatever security you are clearing. This goes for any device, not just phone. Some people even go ports on their laptops filled in with an epoxy or something so that ports can't be accessed. Of course, that just makes you look that much more suspicious. How paranoid are you, and what data do you really have that you don't want to be seen?


> what data do you have

That's really irrelevant. The question should be, "what data does the government think I have, and what evidence do they have that I have it?"

Crossing the border feels like "guilty until proven innocent", which completely goes against everything this country was founded on. If I'm not traveling with my wife and kids, I'll put up a much bigger fight at security check points. Yes, it's annoying to the people who have to check me, but they're being paid for it (well, not while there's a shutdown) so I don't feel too bad.

If they do have evidence of wrong doing, it shouldn't be hard to get a warrant. We should be following due process at the border, especially for American citizens.


Driving through, they can do friendly things like dismantle your car looking for contraband.


Wait, within 100 miles of a border the 4th amendment doesn't apply? There are entire cities, large ones, within 100 miles of a border. Does the 4th amendment not apply to the citizens of those cities? That would be a rather serious problem.


There is a Border Search Exception to the 4th Amendment established by the courts; this ruling has no relevance at at port of entry.


It has no relevance to the Border Patrol within 100 miles of a US border or coastline, which is even more ridiculous.


Yeah, it should be more like 10 miles or less. I don't understand why they're given so much leeway.


This should have been enough:

  A. Contiguous states - 12 nautical miles towards sea, one full state inwards
  B. Alaska and Puerto Rico - 12 nautical miles towards sea, 3 nautical miles inwards
  C. Archipelagic territories (including Hawaii) - 100 nautical miles towards sea, 1 nautical mile inwards
  D. Airports - airport administrative zone


*If they have cause to believe you just crossed the border.




Consider applying for YC's Winter 2027 batch! Applications are open till November 2.

Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: