> Due to Microsoft Windows' dominance in desktop operating systems, Windows is the platform most targetted by spyware, viruses, and ransomware.
That may be true, but a much higher proportion of downloaded Mac software lacks code signing. Opting in to that as a developer on the Mac will carry a lot of risk of kafkaesque deactivation and, and most don’t want to deal with that. On Windows, on the other hand, it’s like getting an SSL certificate. Apple’s philosophy on the developer program is antiquated, obsolete, and has compromised the security of the platform.
How many Mac users do you think limit themselves to only signed apps? It’s much easier to do this on Windows (but requires a small amount of technical understanding, or is it too much for Gitlab employees?). But when you enforce the policy at the corporate domain level, you won’t be neutering the machine’s usefulness as you would on the Mac. Unsigned apps on Windows tend to be the janky ones, while the signed apps found on the Apple Store tend to be garbage in my experience.
Relying on “less malware is created for Mac” is a terrible idea in general. This isn’t the 90’s. When you are Gitlab, a high value target for sophisticated, targeted attacks, that won’t help you.
Good Security is a balancing act between safety and convenience, and Apple gets it completely wrong. Therefore I would be very cautious about trusting Gitlab’s security posture given their apparent ignorance on the subject.
> If your certificate expires, users can no longer launch installer packages for your Mac applications that were signed with this certificate.
> Apple Developer Program membership is required to request, download, and use signing certificates issued by Apple.
> Note: Apple can revoke digital certificates at any time at its sole discretion. For more information, read the Apple Developer Program License Agreement in your developer account.
… and many paragraphs detailing what parts of your app will break when certificates are revoked.
There are more nuances involved than I care to list in full here, though I’d be happy to be proven wrong about this.
I can’t remember the last time I allowed an unsigned app to run on Mac, I can’t even think of examples recently where I’ve gone “oh **, this thing is unsigned?!”. I’d love examples of high quality apps without a basic codesigned certificate, maybe we have a disagreement over the term “quality”.
“App Store apps are garbage” is also kinda rich, it’s not windows, the Mac App Store is the go-to source for distributing Mac apps at this point. There’s some examples of popular apps not on the MAS but they grow fewer by the year.
> There’s some examples of popular apps not on the MAS but they grow fewer by the year.
Well, yeah, the success stories have the budgets to handle compliance issues, and to manage risk appropriately. Apple will also be more lenient with large publishers for a number of reasons. I wasn't talking about popular apps, I was talking about apps that make me productive. Things made for power users. Popular isn't a concern there. But if BigCo doesn't allow me to install it, that's a dealbreaker for me working there. Experienced that in 2010 when working for a Fortune 50. One approved text editor, one approved browser. The productivity apps I use are not on the app store. They are signed, but chances are that a locked down Mac will require App Store installations only, while a Microsoft configuration would be more optimal.
For the record, I DO prefer a Mac for productivity. But when it comes to security, Microsoft wins. Or even better, Linux (though Microsoft is giving it a run for its money with W11)
Kdiff3 had its last release in 2014, old multiplatform apps that weren’t updated would have this problem. Zenmap seemed to not be unsigned? Wireshark was definitely signed, which I was kinda surprised about. I wouldn’t have expected QT apps to be signed, but looks like even those have some support. I’d also argue there’s better Mac apps, at least in terms of kdiff3 ;-).
Fair enough on App Store / popularity, my point was mainly saying the apps on the App Store are of “lesser quality” / the lowest quality is ridiculous. It’s not like the 30% of setapps not-on-the-AppStore apps are explicitly not doing it from a quality standpoint. Most are just because they don’t want to / financially can’t afford the revenue split.
That may be true, but a much higher proportion of downloaded Mac software lacks code signing. Opting in to that as a developer on the Mac will carry a lot of risk of kafkaesque deactivation and, and most don’t want to deal with that. On Windows, on the other hand, it’s like getting an SSL certificate. Apple’s philosophy on the developer program is antiquated, obsolete, and has compromised the security of the platform.
How many Mac users do you think limit themselves to only signed apps? It’s much easier to do this on Windows (but requires a small amount of technical understanding, or is it too much for Gitlab employees?). But when you enforce the policy at the corporate domain level, you won’t be neutering the machine’s usefulness as you would on the Mac. Unsigned apps on Windows tend to be the janky ones, while the signed apps found on the Apple Store tend to be garbage in my experience.
Relying on “less malware is created for Mac” is a terrible idea in general. This isn’t the 90’s. When you are Gitlab, a high value target for sophisticated, targeted attacks, that won’t help you.
Good Security is a balancing act between safety and convenience, and Apple gets it completely wrong. Therefore I would be very cautious about trusting Gitlab’s security posture given their apparent ignorance on the subject.
From https://developer.apple.com/support/certificates/
> If your certificate expires, users can no longer launch installer packages for your Mac applications that were signed with this certificate.
> Apple Developer Program membership is required to request, download, and use signing certificates issued by Apple.
> Note: Apple can revoke digital certificates at any time at its sole discretion. For more information, read the Apple Developer Program License Agreement in your developer account.
… and many paragraphs detailing what parts of your app will break when certificates are revoked.
There are more nuances involved than I care to list in full here, though I’d be happy to be proven wrong about this.