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> The places with the highest rates of male nonwork include parts of Arizona, New Mexico, Nevada, Kentucky, West Virginia, Arkansas and Michigan.

The areas of high unemployment in Arizona and New Mexico overlap almost exactly with the Indian reservations. A problem deserving its own analysis.



Does that mean that more Indians are unemployed, or that the reservations were placed in the greatest economic crapholes that could be found?


Both. Many natives are unemployed because reservations were placed in really inconvenient and resource-poor places. Check out the employment rates in neighboring areas: also low.

There's also been a huge transfer of land from tribal to non-tribal/non-Indian ownership [1]: the US government held a lot of land in trust for the tribes, identified a lot of it as "surplus to their needs," and sold it to non-tribal members, and on other reservations they transferred ownership to individual tribal members and then economic pressures pushed them to sell, especially if they traditionally did agriculture and the land wasn't farmable. This land wasn't developed, in general, so there's really not that many places to work on a reservation...

[1] https://www.iltf.org/resources/land-tenure-history/allotment


The folks living in the reservations have not grown their economies. Economic growth isn't something that happens automatically; you have to go out and start new enterprises, invent new technologies, etc. Some cultures are simply incapable of this and will eventually die out; if you want an extreme example go read "Don't Sleep, There are Snakes" by Daniel Everett.


Perhaps you should look at the conditions that were imposed on these areas. Horrible government education and health care, relocation of individuals resulting in horrific suicide rates, boarding schools that beat students for keeping their culture and language, US government mishandling resources to the point the Dept of Interior was required to cut their internet connection multiple times. Never mind the oil and uranium problems.

Its a culture problem, but not from the Native American side. The current generation suffered all these things and is trying to dig out of a hole. The next generation is better poised to grow as the culture is returning.

Also, I would love for you to go to the Seminoles and read them your comment. I expect they would have a words. I would imagine these stats also don't cover pow-wow circuit youth very well, but that would take research.

As a side note, this is the most ignorant and racist comment I have read on HN.


There was this article recently that being poor is a set of bad habits and someone commented "poor is a permanent condition, broke is temporary."

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2590535

Stating it that way seems reasonable enough. I haven't read "Don't Sleep, There are Snakes" fully but from summaries I'm guessing the tribes refused to accept Western ways and were comfortable living the way that let them survive for thousands of years. Which is a reasonable thing to do if you could isolate yourself from the rest of humanity and competition.

This article about Northern native tribes https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8449134 says that they were far enough along building a settled society of farmers and villages when apocalypse struck and the survivors became roving nomads. Just like all our post-apocalypse movies!


You are missing my basic premise, the culture was almost destroyed and is in the process of building backup now. The book has nothing in common with the experience of US Tribes.

The tribes ran the gamut in what they had before Columbus. It is know that trade routes existed bring things only found in the arctic regions south to the deserts and beyond.


Oh, I agree completely. If smallpox hadn't been a factor, then the tribes would have been strong enough to compete. They would have kept their cultures and been able to adapt and grow. It's good to hear that they are rebuilding their culture; it means that they won't die out.

The world would look very different today if the European explorers had brought back a virulent disease (like smallpox) instead of merely chronic ones (like syphilis). They simply had no idea what the risks were. They lucked out with malaria and yellow fever as well; most of Europe is too far north for them to be as big a problem as they are in Africa, or as they were in the American south.


"If smallpox hadn't been a factor, then the tribes would have been strong enough to compete."

Smallpox is the least of the problems that the tribes faced. The government abuse of land and wealth, the beating out of culture, the killing of food sources, and parking the tribes in the middle of nowhere on land that wouldn't grow anything. Broken promises and laughing officials are the problems.


I agree with your last line. The comment made me want to wash after reading it.


If you want a thoughtful and interesting analysis of why you're wrong, read Guns, Germs, and Steel by Jared Diamond. While it's (of course) a simplification of the real world, Diamond looks at questions like "Why did Spaniards conquer Peru, rather than Peruvians invading Spain?". Not surprisingly (to most, I'd hope) it's not because of innate differences between cultures.


You have to be kidding. The Indians are poor because their degenerate culture causes them to be totally cool with poverty?


What is a Native American on a reservation on worthless land in the middle of the desert going to do for a living? I'd like to see a reservation be granted in midtown Manhattan and see what happens.


Merely being within an easy drive of Manhattan has proven quite profitable: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohegan_Indian_Tribe




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